The false axiom to bless the state of Israel or the “jews” to be blessed.

Many people have heard, read or been taught that blessing the (alledged) descendants of Abraham and/or, the present participants of the nation state of Israel, is Gods emphatic will and will insure “blessing” for themselves or their country.
This brief article will explain the fallacy of that understanding of Gen 12:3.

*[[Gen 12:1-3/KJV]]*  v 1 Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will shew thee:  v 2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:  v 3 And I will bless them that bless thee and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Point 1. Its wotthy to note that the passage doesn’t say “I will bless those who bless your descendants and curse those who curse your descendants”, but the statement is first spoken of Abraham himself. It’s later repeated to and about Isaac, and then by Isaac to and about Jacob in Gen 27:29. Thus the statements were made first to and about them as individuals.

About 430+ years later, in Numbers 24:9, this statement of blessing/cursing is used concerning the people or ‘nation’ of Israel because they posessed the testimony of monotheism in contrast with the people of idolotry. See Point 9 below.

2.  The historical setting of the words.

From extra-biblical literature we learn that Nimrod had claimed virgin birth status for himself or his son as the fulfillment of the promise of Gen 3:15.  He had made a tower to the heavens, shot an arrow in the air, and claimed to have killed the God of the clouds of heaven as the activator of the flood, thus securing temporary cult status for himself.   He started subsequent babylonian multi-deity religions of superstitious rituals and sacrifice.

Abraham was told to get up and out of this environment and that through him (Not Nimrod) God would deliver his son and through him [not Nimrod] all nations of humanity would be blessed. 

Thus, there is a strong aspect of individual contrast between Abraham and Nimrod intended by the words ‘thee’ and “in thee shall all nations of the earth be blessed”. God was primarily stating that the promised seed of God would come through Abraham and monotheism, not Nimrod’s false counterfeits and polytheism.

3. The equality of this blessing with the protoevangelion of Gen 3:15.

Since the redemption and blessing of humanity had already been foretold to occur through the seed of the woman (and God) in Gen 3:15, (as understoid by Abel, Lamech [Gen 4:24,25] and others, the life blessing promised through Abraham and his ‘seed’ is the same blessing & promise through the crushing of the serpents head in Gen 3:15 by the atonement for, and ending/changing of the law of sin/death to faith & life.

*[[Gen 3:15]] KJV* And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

4. The covt or promise of mercy/blessing (Gen 3:15) was called ‘my covt’ as it passed through Noah in Gen 6:18 & 9:9,11,13,15; and through Abraham & Isaac in Gen 17, and it took on types and elements of its future fulfillment through these mens experiences and lives.

Some of the typologies the “my covt” aquired as it passed through Noah were:
A. 8 being saved in the ark, with 8 being the number of the new creation,
B. the release and removal of some “cursedness” through the event, (Gen 5:29, Gal 3:13, Rev 22:3; )
C. the changing of some aspects of a ‘heaven & earth’ through a ‘flood’, (compare Dan 9:26, Is 54:9,10 Is 59:19; 2 Pet 3:7)
D. and a judgement upon the people who remained with the former ‘heavens & earth.’ ( Deut 18:15-19; 1 Pet 4:17, 2 Pet 3:7)

Some of the aspects aquired as the covt passed through Abraham were;
A. the miraculous birth of what was called a ‘only’ son;
B. he was named and circumcised on the 8th day;
C. righteousness was declared to be by faith in God’s, then future, good coming and his good interventive power; (John 6:28,29)
D. Tha act of circumcision as a “sign” that righteousness is imputed and recieved by faith and not works of the flesh or law; (Gal 4:11) Circumcision symbolizes open exposure of the head/heart to Gods grace by the cutting away of the flesh (works). The word “flesh” is equated with attempting to appease God or gain or maintain merit, favor or power with God through some sort of works in Rom 4:1,2; Gal 3:2,3.
E. the characteristic that the blessing would, by Gods election, be passed through Isaac thus signifying the election of the miraculous through faith over the way of doubt or striving in self. (Ishmael) See also Gal 4:21ff.
F. the characteristic of a sacrificial offering of his ‘only son’ which then continued to live; ( Gen 22)
G. that God would provide “himself” a sacrificial lamb (Gen 22:8).

The statements of being multiplied exceedingly, of a generational fullfillment, and I believe the land promise, were attatchments to ‘my covenant’ signified by the word ‘and’ in Gen 17:2-9. They were not part of the blessing itself, ceased with the fulfillment of “my covenant” through Christ, and may have spiritual continuance in the eternal (new) covt and its peoples. See point 13 below.

5.  It is easy to assume that since God promised to make a “great nation” through Abraham that this referred to a geographic-religious nation of “Israel’.  But Abraham had been declared righteous for believing God’s promise that he (not Nimrod) would bear the blessing of the seed of God; and later, that he would miraculously father a child in their later age. This birth foretyped the miraculous conception of God and the woman. ( Gen 3:15) Thus, the great nation eventually made through Abraham was/is the righteous nation (Is 9:3; 26:2,5; 55:5; 60:22; 66:8; and in other OT passages) of justification and righteousness by faith in, and subordination to, Christ as God  (John 6:28,29). I peter 2:9 calls the new covt people a “holy Nation” See also Matt 21:43, Rom 10:19. Though many individuals within the progression of the descendancies of Abraham/Israel held faith in the living God and his covt of mercy, both before and during the mosaic covt, the ways and means of the eternal, good covt and the mosaic covts are dissimilar and in contrast. This righteous nation is the nation redeemed from the fall of the law of sin/death and thus redeemed from the presence and fear of death through the law and way of faith.

6.   The ‘nation’ of mosaic covt Israel wasn’t birthed until Moses spoke the words of the covt from Mt Nebo just before Joshua crossed Jordan to accept the stipulations and eventual latter end and judgements of the covt. 

The words of Deut 5:1-3 make it clear that the national mosaic covt was NOT made with the fathers, but began that day, at least 430 or more years after the last statements were made to Abraham as passed through Jacob.

*[[Deu 5:1-3/KJV]]*  v 1 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.  v 2The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.  v 3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.

7.   Paul so openly declares that God was ultimately speaking of blessing all humanity through his miraculous, loving and exemplary coming in Jesus in such places as;

*[[Gal 3:8]] KJV* And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.  (Deut 12:3)

*[[Gal 3:16]] KJV* Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

*[[Gal 3:17-18/KJV]]* v 17 And this I say, that the covenant,[of love, grace and mercy] that was confirmed before [through Abraham] of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. v 18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

*[[Gal 3:29]] KJV* And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Peter adds the same;

*[[Act 3:25]] KJV* Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

By contrast, those who would misinterpret this as if it was intended to refer to a blessing upon only the genetic descendants (seeds) of Abraham or upon the later, temporary nation of the law of Moses
invoke error and a ‘cursed’ doctrine and way upon themselves as Paul affirms;

*[[Gal 1:8-9/KJV]]* v 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you [such as blessing genetic or national “Israel” to recieve blessing] than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. v 9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

The everlasting covt would come to/through his physical descendants but not exclusively for them. And its elements are actually in contrast against the conditional, ritualistic, temporary ways and means of the national covt as stated by Jeremiah.

*[[Jer 31:32-34/KJV]]* v 32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: v 33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my [New] laws [John 6:28,29, Rom 3:27-31 etc] in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. v 34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, [Good God] from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

See also Ez 25:20 & Isa 65:1,2

Sometimes we as people need to subjectively experience, and see the wrong, negative, way of striving in fear and works of the flesh or religious law to help clarify the right, good way of life, truth and grace.

8.  Abraham testified that he himself was not the source of the blessedness of the covt when he gave tithes to Melckizedec, the king of the city of Peace. Heb 5-7 develops this.

9.   In numbers 22-24 Balaam blesses the people of Israel at a time when they posessed and embodied the testimony of monotheism and the covt of mercy from Gen 3:15 and the patrirchs (Abraham, Isaac, Jacob/Israel). This blessing is in direct contrast with the idolotrous beliefs of Balak and his people. Balak had even attempted to ‘curse’ the israelites by causing them to stumble against their own Good beliefs of the monotheistic GOOD God of heaven by enticing some of them into idolotry. Numbers 24:9 then, is given as a blessing to the people of, and the eventual victory of, the truth of the living monotheis creator God of heaven; in contrast with peoples believing ‘God’ was to be found or made in inanimate objects. Balaam then goes on to tell of the eventual ends of the idol worshiping groups of the area. This blessing has nothing to do with genetic identity and is not directly related to the national covt created shortly afterwards. It is related to these people posessing the truth of the living creator God of heaven and the testimony of his covt of love and mercy, in contrast with the curse of the fallacy of idols and their worship.

*[[Psa 96:5/KJV]]* For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.

Just as Balaam’s would not (after being corrected by the donkey) compromise Gods election of blessing to the people entrusted with the testimony of the truth of the living God and the (then future) miraculous covt of mercy & life expressed through Abraham-Jacob; so also, the blessing to the people and way of the now fulfilled miraculous new covt of grace & truth through Jesus and His indwelling Spirit dare not be compromised.  The sons/daughters of God through faith and life in the GOOD name of Christ are the heirs of the promise as explained in Gal 3:8-29. See also Gal 1:8,9.

10. The writer of Hebrews says that Abraham, Isaac, Israel were looking for a ‘heavenly country’ with GOOD foundations and statutes of God. Thus, they nor the participants of the mosaic instructions had yet recieved the complete principles, instructions and powers of the kingdom of creator God/heaven.

*[[Heb 11:9-10/KJV]]* v 9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: v 10. For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God…………. v 13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. v 14. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. v 15. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, (Eden) they might have had opportunity to have returned. v 16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city………… v 39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: v 40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

*[[Heb 12:18-19/KJV]]* v 18. For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest, v 19. And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more: v 22. But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, v. 28. Wherefore we (first century believers/followers) are receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

11.  In contrast and comparison with the false axiom that to bless national or genetic Israel will insure blessing, we have this declaration about the new covt peoples of Christ in Isa 65:16; 

That he who blesseth himself in the earth (in his body/life) shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.

12. Though its true that Abraham recieved a promise that his physical descendants (through Isaac) would, after a captivity in egypt, become as numerous as the stars, and also that he would be a father of MANY nations, this multiplying aspect of procreation applies to almost any pair who’s descendants are recorded over time.

I know of a few Amish and old order mennonite folks who number their children above 10, grandchildren above 100 and great granchildren towards 1000, all within 80 or so years. And my personal paternal namesake has likely tens of 1000’s of present living “cousins” descending from a documented pair in only 250 years and about 13-14 generations.

In addition to the miracles of fatherhood in his later years, was God just telling Abraham that the fulfillment of the promise of blessing & mercy to all peoples of the earth by Gods interventive seed, atonement and love was to come after MANY, MANY generations, and that God would protect the recording of this lineage to help confirm this promised ‘seed, until the seed would come’? The geneologies were destroyed in 70 AD.

Thus, the blessing is not to be equated with having numerous descendants, as it might seem, but with the redemption from edenic death, and forgiveness of ‘sins’, through faith in the life and new law of Christ as the incarnation of the Good, Loving God in fulfillment of Gen 3:15.

13. Paul makes a strong point in Rom 3-5 and Gal 3 that the promise to Abraham was made BEFORE the sign of circumcision (Rom 4::9-14). Circumcision, Paul says, was a sign of righteousness by faith apart from works of flesh and law. (Rom 4:11) He adds that righteousness was imputed for faith in the miraculous birth. (Ron 4:18-22) And in Gal 3 he adds that it was 430 years before the formation of the nation of the law !

Thus the fulfillment of the covt of mercy (gen 3:15) and promise of blessing to Abraham did/does not only apply to/through the physical descendants nor to/through the way and nation of the works of law, [flesh] but to all/any peoples of the earth through GOOD faith apart from those aspects.

*[[Act 17:26]] KJV* And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

*[[Deu 32:8-9/LXXE]]* v 8 When the Most High divided the nations, when he separated the sons of Adam, [Noah] he set the bounds of the nations according to the number of the angels of God. v 9 And his people Jacob became the portion of the Lord, Israel was the line of his inheritance.

Though the line of his inheiritance was through Isaac & Jacob/Israel as ‘sons of God, the reciipients of the inheiritance through the good truth of the living God as revealed in Jesus are any/all of the sons of Adam (Noah).

14. Rom 11:25 & 26.

*[[Rom 11:25-26/KJV]]* v 25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. v. 26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Many might still believe in a needed continuation of Israel because they believe and have been taught that Rom 11:26 prophecied that all national Israel is to one day be saved after God is finished with saving and rapturing ‘gentiles. But this is not what this passage teaches.

In first century pre-70 AD timeframe, some individuals of the jews who originally disbelieved the gospel were temporarily blinded to the gospel (rom 11:7-10, 25) and some were prophecied to eventually come to faith through the testimony and fullness of God in believing people of the gentiles, before the soon coming judgement.

Those who disbelieved were prophecied to, and did, become jealous to the point of hounding and persecuting those who proclaimed Jesus and his words as lord, not moses, the rabbis or Caesar. Some eventually became emulators if their faith and believers in Jesus.

The believers and followers of Christ [identified as “all Israel” in ch 9], were prophecied to be relieved from this persecution and recieve continuance, preservation (saving) and favorable judgement by the deliverer coming to the believers through the roman armies.

And this was indeed the manner in which (and so) the “All Israel” [of God through Christ] were to recieve deliverance. (saving)

For more information and a study on Rom 11 see:

Abrabam, Isaac, Jacob/Israel all had faith in the living, monotheistic creator God of heaven and walked in Grace and faith of his goodness and future seed of mercy. (Gen 3:15)

These three individuals also pre-characterized and foreimaged the three progressive places of God during the progressive revealing of his will and person.

Abram/Abraham, represents the father; Isaac represented Jesus, the Son, and Jacob/Isrsel represents the changed, good, empowered life of those who become sons/daughters of God by faith recieving Jesus’ person, doctrine, example, will and intent (spirit) within. (Rom 9:6-13,24) This “tri-unity” is also symbolized by the root (Father), trunk (Son/Jesus) and branches (disciples, children of God) of the olive tree and vine and by Jesse, David and Solomon. (Rev 22:17.

Thus, Abrahams “seed”, spiritually speaking, is the people of faith in Christ as God and adhearance to his way and will of peace. They, (we) experience the LIVING presence, power, person, truth and grace of God (John 17:3) through Jesus; casting out and mortifying dead idols from “Canaan” of our bodies (new earth) and the Peace city of new Jerusalem of our hearts during the sojourn of our lives.

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Romans 13; Render unto Caesar; The temple tax incident

These 3 passages are usually referred to as part of the teaching that it is a Christians duty to pay taxes and to support whatever “Caesar”  or the Govt requests or requires of you.

This article will discuss each of these passages and reveal that none of them, nor the 3 of them together, instruct the believer to render tribute or taxes to “Ceasar” or to ideologies or administrations foreign to the Good principles, Govt, (Is 9:6,7) Will and Truths of God for life as revealed through his incarnation in Jesus.


*[[Mat 17:24-27/KJV]]*  v 24  And when they were come to Capernaum, they that received tribute money came to Peter, and said, Doth not your master pay tribute?  v 25 He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers?  v 26 Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free.  v 27 Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee.

Many since Ireneous  have assumed and taught that this was a Roman tax, and that Jesus was instructing the reluctant support and payment of that tax..  it was not.  It was a tax to support mosaic covt temple(s) and their administrations.  It was first instructed as a one time event by Moses in Ex 30:12, then appealed to by by Joash and later by Nehemiah.  By the time of Jesus, the leaders of the jews had turned it into an enforced (Acts 17:9) yearly tax.

Jesus pulled Peter aside to instruct him after Peter had assumed that Jesus would follow the custom of paying the mosaic covt temple administration tax.

Jesus likened himself to a [the] King of the earth, and his disciples as the Kings children, free from and foreign to the mosaic covt [or Roman] way and administration.  (John 19:12; Luke 23:2, Acts 17:4-9) He was inaugragating a new administration based on grace and truths of life and its goodness  (John 1:17) where the believers bodies and lives are the temple of God.  John the baptist had already been preaching a repentence from mosaic covt principles and way in preparation for the ikngdom of heaven.

To ‘cover’ for Peters blurtation, Jesus instructed Peter to obtain a coin from the mouth of a fish in the lake where Peter would  have fished just before following Jesus and his new administration.  In this manner Peter was paying the temple tax from the man of his former understanding and allegience.  Jesus shared responsibility for the error of the blurtation with Peter since he himself (as God pre-incarnate)  had given the foundations for the tax through Moses.  Peter obtained payment for himself and Jesus, and Jesus used the event to continue to instruct Peter (and the others) of the contrasting characteristics, principles and elements between the mosaic law and nation and Gods new way of peace, grace and truth. (John 1:17)  It’s unlikely that Peter paid the temple tax from this point forward.  If they did, the payments would have likely stopped at the crucifiction when Jesus fulfilled the foretypes of the lamb sacrifice included as part of mosaic covt instructions.

Though the principles (Is 61:8; Matt 17:25,26) for the disciples treatment of the Roman poll & tribute tax would be the same, this particular tax was dealing with a jewish temple administration tax.


Romans 13 was a continuation of the topics of Romans 11 & 12: (such as vs 12:19)  and previous chapters.  

In chapters 10:19 & 11:11 he had been telling them that some of the jews who initially disbelieved were prophecied to become jealous of the believers from among the gentiles (former israel tribes and romans) who would recieve the freedom & fullness of God. This jealousy, and the religious enmity that the jews already had towards any of their members who had left the law and believed in Christ, was causing them to persecute believers wherever they were found. Towards the end of ch 11, he says that some of these who were jealous were to recieve mercy from the believers who also had once disbelieved, but who had recieved mercy through the apostles. Then in ch 12: 1,2 he adds the imagery of being living sacrifices; dead to solely their own goals and guards of self preservation but alive to mercifully sharing and embodying the goodness, truths and grace of God. Later in chapter 12 & just before ch 13 he writes;

*[[Rom 12:14]] KJV* Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not. *[[Rom 12:17]] KJV* Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men. *[[Rom 12:19-21]] KJV* Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. v 20. Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head. v. 21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

It is in this context that Paul pens the words of Rom 13;

*[[Rom 13:1-8/KJV]]*  v 1. Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.  v 2.  Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, [of Gods protection] resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.  v 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:  v 4  For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.  v 5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.  v 6 For this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God’s ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.   v 7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.  v 8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

It has been long taught since Ireneous, and easy to assume that the higher powers of Rom 13:1 was referring to the govt of Rome and by modern extension to whatever calls itself govt weather right or wrong. It does not refer to the govt of rome or other human engineered govt. From the context of ch 12, vs 19, he was instructing first century believers to not take vengeance on their enemies who were persecuting them, but to submit and defer to the imminent living judgement of the most High (God) as prophecied in Deut 32; Isaiah 59, Dan 7 and many other places. This judgement of God was to come through the roman invasion of 70 AD as prophecied in Deut 32:42 and Dan 9:26, but, the Romans themselves were reacting with fury and revenge against a jewish revolt and slaughter of the one legion of the army; not in direct protection of the rightness and divine rights to life of the believers.

*[[Deu 32:42]] KJV* I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; and that with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges (that is) upon the enemy.

The nkjv reads; from the long haired heads of the leaders of enemy (the Romans)

*[[Dan 9:26]] KJV* And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

God had been referred to as the most high 19 times in Psalms, 12 in Daniel, 4 in Genesis, 2 in Hosea and Lamentations and once each in Numbers, Deueteronomy, 2 Samuel, Isaiah and Ezekiel.

This first century experience of Romans 13 correlates to the prophecy of Dan 7 where the followers of the lamb (Jesus) were called saints of the most high.

*[[Dan 7:18/KJV]]* But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

*[[Dan 7:22/KJV]]* Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

*[[Dan 7:25/KJV]]* And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

*[[Dan 7:27/KJV]]* And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

The saints of the most high were to (and did) defer vengeance and wrath unto Divine authority through Jesus and the Angels.

Thus the higher powers of Rom 13:1,2 was and is the interventive powers and favorable judgement on the rightness and right to life of the followers of the lamb and his law of faith. (John 6:28,29)

For further discussion of Rom 13 and Render to Caesar see also


*[[Luk 20:20-25/KJV]]*  v 20 And they watched him, and sent forth spies, which should feign themselves just men, that they might take hold of his words, that so they might deliver him unto the power and authority of the governor. v 21  And they asked him, saying, Master, we know that thou sayest and teachest rightly, neither acceptest thou the person of any, but teachest the way of God truly:  v 22 Is it lawful for us to give tribute unto Caesar, or no?  v 23 But he perceived their craftiness, and said unto them, Why tempt ye me?  v 24  Shew me a penny. Whose image and superscription hath it? They answered and said, Caesar’s.  v 25 And he said unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be Caesar’s, and unto God the things which be God’s.

The render unto Ceasar instructions were given to the scribes sent by the Pharisees and Herodians to attempt to trick Jesus into confessing either disallegience or allegience to Caesar.  If he confessed or instructed allegience to Caesar they would have been able to accuse him to the jews and the nation.  If he would have confessed dis-allegience to Caeser they would have informed the romans and attempted to bring trouble against Jesus that way. And in fact this is what they did.

*[[Luk 23:2]] KJV* And they began to accuse him, saying, We found this fellow perverting the nation, and forbidding to give tribute to Caesar, saying that he himself is Christ a King.

His response covered both options..  Those with allegience & fear towards Ceasar [as God] bore his inscription with their labor and life, and were to render tribute to Ceasar. Those with allegience to God and Jesus as King bore his inscription and were to be free to render tribute and honour to Jesus/God, themselves and others. (Love your neighor AS yourself). Its often thought that Jesus was instructing his disciples to render a portion to Caesar and govt and to render tithe or whatever portion determined to God.   This is NOT the instruction given by Jesus and he was not speaking directly to his disciples. He was instructing the scribes  to decide their allegience and thus citizenship.  It had been prophecied in Jer 31 that at this time, the houses of Judah and Israel were to be sown with the seed (intent and desires) of men and beast. (devouring) Thus there was little difference in spirit and principle between Romans [the 4th kingdom beast of Dan 2 & 7] and Jews under mosaic law.  Both would have likely wanted pre-eminence and dominion and there is evidence of a growing secret jewish influence in Rome.

Just a few days later the scribes proclaimed their disloyalty to,  and faithlessness in Jesus , shouting “we have no king but Caesar.

Thus, none of these passages individually or collectively instruct a payment of support or tribute taxes to ideologies or systems foreign to the good  kingdom of peace and truths of God and life through Jesus.

The U.S. code of regulations confirms this.

They define citizenship as having  allegience to a state.  A state is logically a collection of statements, beliefs and principles or ideologiea.  And the liability for income taxes is assessed on those who are citizens of (have given submisive allegience to) the exclusive govornment of the federal military district of Columbus and its statements, principles, beliefs and declarations, or to residents physically or politically ‘residing’ within the district of Columbus, one of the federal territorial states, or their alledgedly needful military lands and properties within the several states.

These were/are also some of the reasons for the distinctions between direct and indirect taxes in the Constitution.   Direct taxes on wealth, payments and labor of state citizens and other non-citizen ‘aliens’ who had not professed direct allegience or willing subjugation to the federal,international military state of art 1, sect 8, clause 17), was and still is unconstitutional.

The scriptures pertaining to the new covt people also agree saying in Isaiah;

*[[Isa 61:8/KJV]]* For I the LORD love judgment, I hate robbery for burnt offering; (forcing someone to support beliefs or an administration against his/her beliefs) and I will direct their work in truth, and I will make an everlasting [perpetual] covenant with them.

*[[Isa 65:16/KJV]]* That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.

By contrast of the teaching of govt as the “higher powers” of Rom 13, Is 9:6,7 prophecied that the govt of God towards humanity rested on his shoulders and there was to be no end to the increase of HIS govornment (of grace & truths from john 1:17).

*[[Isa 9:6-7/KJV]]*  v 6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.   v 7  Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, (Jesus) and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Since the law came by Moses but Grace and truth through Christ Jesus, (John 1:17) the Govt of Immanuel should logically be based on experiential grace, truth and freedom. Some examples of these truths might include a declaration of the divine origins and good will of God for life, his GOOD intent and willl in having a two gendered procreational design of perpetual 100 year lifespans, and the continuation of the earth. Other aspects which stem from these truths would be to instruct the need to voluntarily govorn and even reduce population to live within healthy parameters as dictated by water and land use needs for wildlife, aquatic, food, recreation and other needs. Still other aspects are the better management of waste recycling including the eventual redeemption of landfills and elimination of non- biodegradables, non recycleables and spent uranium; restoring the quality of foods regarding nutrient levels; managing and balancing the harvesting of resources rather than raping the earth for profit, and investing in restoring and maintaining the ecology.,

No man can serve two masters, (lords) they cannot serve both corporate profit (mammon) and serve divine truths of life and subsequent generations.

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The meaning of the word ‘body’ as a foundation for understanding 1 cor 15:35-44.

This is a study of the use of the word ‘body’, as used in the N.T., in the O.T., in common language and language of law to mean a collection of doctrine, teachings or beliefs.

These beliefs become assymilated in the soul and life experience, and become part of the substance and ‘body’ of the WHOLE person. The “body” of a persons beliefs and doctrines answers the questions; “What are you made of?, what do you stand for,? what are your beliefs, principles and convictions?

Since the beliefs, law, truths and way of Christ were ‘ingested’ and eaten by believers in Jesus as God in the first century, they became a plural, corporal continuation of the doctrine, “person” and thus “body” of God/Christ. In the first century setting, the plural “body” of individuals in Christ needed publicly judged as righteous, true and favored in contrast with the natural, Adamic man under the edenic or mosaic law.

In John 6, Jesus teaches that to ingest the spirit and life of his words (vs 63) is to eat his flesh (body) and drink his blood. I believe that the blood represents the life-will even unto death.

John 6:53-63/KJV v 53. Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. 54. Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. v 55. For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. v 56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him. v 57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me. v 58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: (John 6:28,29); not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever. v 59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum. v 60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it? v 61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? v 62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before? v 63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Then in Matt 26 During the symbolic breaking of bread, He reinforces the point that the bread (words & truths) is his body and the wine his blood.

*Mat 26:26-29/KJV* v 26 And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body. v 27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; v 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. v 29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.

Vs 29 can be shown to refer to and be fulfilled in Luk 24:30-31; v 30, And it came to pass, as he sat at meat with them, he took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them. v 31 And their eyes were opened, and they knew him; and he vanished out of their sight.

Here it doesn’t say that Jesus actually ate the broken bread, (symbolizing his own body of doctrine) but departed that they (the apostles) might eat and ’embody’ his resurrected and verified words and truths. Jesus had taught them that the kingdom of God was (would be) within them, and (HE) was now supporting and inaugragating the kingdom indwelling by breaking the bread while physically departing from their presence. In the same timeframe, in John 20:22, Jesus had breathed on them saying recieve the (indwelling) holy Spirit. I believe the two actions by Jesus had the same, overlapping meaning, thus equating the GOOD, loving, living, indwelling truths and doctrines of God and Jesus as the holy Spirit. Jesus was eating and drinking the bread & wine with them in the fathers kingdom as the holy Spirit within them.

In the letter of first corinthians, Paul expands upon this teaching of Christ as bread, meat and “body”. Paul emphasizes that they are (should be) one body, belief and doctrine, but are many members, tools and expressions outflowing from the one good doctrine and set of beliefs. Notice that as far back as chapter 6, Paul mentions physical meats and the physical individual body in a perishing way, as he begins to allude to Jesus teaching in John 6. Paul then reminds the readers that the GOOD body and life of Christ indwelling is not to be compromised and adultered (fornication)) and can’t be purchased. (harlotry)

*[[Joh 6:27]] KJV* Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.

*1Co 6:13/KJV* Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.

*1Co 6:19/KJV* What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

*1Co 10:16/KJV* The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion (common union) of the body (doctrine, way & ttuths) of Christ?

*1Co 10:17/KJV* For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread. (one way)

*1Co 11:24/KJV* And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

*1Co 12:12/KJV* For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

*1Co 12:13/KJV* For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. (Intent)

*1Co 12:14/KJV* For the body is not one member, but many.

*1Co 12:18/KJV* But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.

*1Co 12:20/KJV* But now are they many members, yet but one body.

*1Co 12:25/KJV* That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

*1Co 12:27/KJV* Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.

*1Co 15:35/KJV* But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?

*1Co 15:37/KJV* And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:

*1Co 15:38/KJV* But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

*1Co 15:44/KJV* It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Then in a section of Isaiah which can be easily associated with the timeframe of the growth of the nation of Christ and thus 30-70 AD events, we have the prophecy that the believers would rise along with Christ while those of the disbelieving body of Moses would not.

*[[Isa 26:12-14/KJV]]* v 12 LORD, thou wilt ordain peace for us: for thou also hast wrought all our works in us. v 13 O LORD our God, other lords beside thee have had dominion over us: but by thee [Jesus] only will we make mention of thy name. v 14 They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish. *Isa 26:19/KJV* Thy (God/Jesus’) dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

Though, there had been a private vindicative, approving and ressuccitating appearance after his resurrection, (Hosea 6:2) there would be a public return in the clouds, and the public resurrectiom & victorious change of the individuals of Jesus corporal body of Peace in 66-70 .

Paul has quoted Is 28:12 in 1 cor 14:21, confirming that these Isaiah passages have been in his mind as he writes the letter and support that they have first century application weather 30 AD or 70 AD or both.,

And in a passage of Is 59, with a timed fulfillment in @ 40-68 AD we see that the persecuted adherants to Christ doctrine, truths and way were considered as dead and awaiting deliverence.

*Isa 59:10 KJV* We grope for the wall like the blind, and we grope as if we had no eyes: we stumble at noonday as in the night; we are in desolate places as dead men.

I cor 15:35-41 as a continuation and extension of 12:4-14,20 & 27-31 explains that the resurrected individuals of the corporal body of Christ would retain their individuality at the time of the resurrection and victorious change.

Thus summarizing, Jesus and then Pauls use the word “body”, while acknowledging and noting the retainment of individual aspects, refers to the people who ingest and embidy his doctrine& truths and recieve his grace. The “resurrection of the body” refers to the resurrection and changing of this people group in contrast with the edenic or mosaic ‘body’ of law. This would occur coincidentally with, but not preceed those ‘firstfruits’ who had fallen asleep (died through natural or inflicted death) in Christ between 30-66 AD. We affirm a resurrection or continuation of the spirit and angel (body) of each one after death, which aspect Paul affirms in Acts 23:6-8 and talks of in 1 Thess 4:16,17, and 1 cor 15:33 &51,52.

After talking of a unified, yet individual body of Christs doctrine and truths, why would Paul change it in chapt 15 to refer to a future eternal reconstitution of the physical bones and body during an alleged restored edenic state?

To further confirm this view and meaning of the word “body”, we look to Jude’s use of it in his epistle.

Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

What is meant by the “body of Moses”?   Did the angel fight with Satan about moses’ physical bones? Consider these cross references to help your contemplation.

1. Dan 10:13;  But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.

2. Dan 12:1; And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

3. Zec 3:2  And the LORD said unto Satan, The LORD rebuke thee, O Satan; even the LORD that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

4. 2Pe 2:11 Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.

5. Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought with Michael.

2Co 3:7-13; 7.  But if the ministration of death, [body & law of Moses] written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:  8.  How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?  9. For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. 10. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. 11. For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.  12. Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: 13. And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

John Gills commentary of Jude 1:9 recognizes that some understand this to mean the physical body of moses but then states his contrasting personal understanding;

but it is best of all to understand it of the law of Moses, which is sometimes called Moses himself, Joh 5:45; and so the body of Moses, or the body of his laws, the system of them; just as we call a system of laws, and of divinity, such an one’s body of laws, and such an one’s body of divinity: and this agrees with the language of the Jews, who say, of statutes, service, purification, that they are גופי התורה, “the bodies of the law” and so of Misnic treatises, as those which concern the offerings of turtle doves, and the purification of menstruous women, that they are גופי, “the bodies” of the traditions s, that is, the sum and substance of them: so the decalogue is said to be “the body of the Shema”, or “Hear, O Israel”, De 6:4, so Clemens of Alexandria says, that there are some who consider the body of the Scriptures, the words and names, as if they were, το σωμα του μωσεως, “the body of Moses”

Thus, the Angel Michael was not wrestling with the devil about Moses physical bones body, but I believe about the righteousness of the law and thus (like the garden law) the devils inability to accuse, torture and condemn humanity or the jews based on either garden or mosaic law , due to the new law, new creation, new words and new GOOD way of God and life being enacted by God in Christ. Paul touches on these things in 2 Cor 3 above and Eph 6 below.

*[[Eph 6:12/KJV]]* For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Furthermore, consider these among the several definitions of the word “body” in Websters dictionary.

2. Matter, as opposed to spirit.

3. A person; a human being; sometimes alone; more generally, with some or no; as, somebody; nobody.

5. A collective mass; a number of individuals or particulars united; as the body of mankind. Christians united or the Church is called the body, of which each Christian is a member, and Christ the head.

7. A corporation; a number of men, united by a common tie, by one form of government, or by occupation; as the legislative body; the body of the clergy; body corporate; body politic.

10. A pandect; a general collection; a code; a system; as a body of laws; a body of divinity.

The letter of Romans is yet another place to see the corporal and covanental use of the word ‘body’. In chapters 4-8 & 12, Paul often refers to the body in a corporate doctrinal or covanental sense such as *[[Rom 6:6/KJV]* Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin [covenant of death made with Adam] might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. [the body of the edenic law or its enmities or effects.]

Most uses of the word body in this section refer to the corporal or covanental sense. Here is another example from Romans

*[[Rom 7:4/KJV]]* Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; [by the authority of his new words and the new law of faith, John 6:28,29; not his death] that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, [verified from heaven] that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Ephesians and Colossians also contain several corporal or covanental uses of the word body.

Thus the “body” of Moses was the temporary inferior law and way of Moses.

The “body”of Adamic humanity under just the edenic law of “sin and “death” (without faith towards the edenic promise of Gen 3:15) would have been referred to as the body of flesh, sin, works, inadequacy (striving), fear, & insecurity and “death”. The body of Moses was a ‘corporal’, public body of conditional law, flesh, insecurities, fear, etc. BOTH would have been and are in contrast with the “body”, spirit and life of Christ continuing through indwelling.

In John 3, Jesus affirmed to the Pharisees; Marvel not that ye must be born again ( born a new way of freedom through the spirit; intent and will, of God/Jesus law). That which is flesh (striving in and against edenic or Moses law) is flesh; that which is spirit (rest, freedom and life of faith in the Good way of Jesus as God) is “spirit” (of the GOOD supernatural intent, will and life of God).

From the ISBE definition of “BODY”:

#4. The Body and Sin: From all this it is apparent that the body in itself is not necessarily evil, a doctrine which is taught in Greek philosophy, (and indirectly in Ireneousian, fundamentalist, and most ‘christian’ theology; my addition), but nowhere in the Old Testament and New Testament. The rigid and harsh dualism met with in Plato is absent from Paul’s writings, and is utterly foreign to the whole of Scripture. Here we are distinctly taught, on the one hand, that the body is subordinated to the soul, but on the other, with equal clearness, that the human body has a dignity, originally conferred upon it by the Creator, who shaped it out of earth, and glorified it by the incarnation of Christ, the sinless One, though born of a woman.

The so called “christian” doctrine that continued procreational physical lifecycles and death is evidence that the body and life is still under ‘sin’ and thus subject to and expecting a yet future eternal physical resurrection to a alledged restored eternal edenic state is thus shown to be a false and erroneous doctrine in need of confession and cleansing. (I John 1:7-9) It is similar to the doctrine of Plato and the greek philosophers. In christiandom, it stems mostly from Ireaneous and other writers, not from Creator Jesus or his apostles.

The “body” and substance (beliefs and ways of the spirit & soul) of individuals of humanity were in temporary ignorance, insecurity and fear (death) under the realm and effect of Adamic (garden) and mosaic law. The victorious fulfilling of the coming of the seed promised to humanity through the woman AND his law (John 6:28,29, Rom 3:27-31; I John 3:21-24) ) of adoption, security, divinity and experiential empowerment of the life; cancels and destroys that fear, insecurity, “death” and enmity, and enables the willing seeker to be successful in glorifying God in ones life. (rom 3:23,24) Thats why the authority of the law of faith (John 6:28,29) is stressed in context with the ‘sin’ of coming short of the glory of God in Rom 3:23-31. It is the begining axiom to remedy the previous inability to glorify God.

Song “happy”

Thus, the first century public resurrection of the “dead” in Adam (and Moses) was partly the public approval of the adhearants of Christ, and public disapproval of the ways of moses or pagan babylon.

The “body” of truths and the authority of those truths as freeing and establishing law through faith, was resurrected (1 Cor 15:21) from having been judged as wrong, dead and ‘sin’ by the religious authorities (from both judaism and paganism) of its day.

The truths and “body” of Christ resurrected could need a similar resurrection from the religious “body” of the interpretations of Ireneous and from the oppression of insubordinate, disbekieving, dishinouring corporate “bodies” calling itself govornment.

For lately we have lived in a jungle.

Steve Miller Band; Jungle Love

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When and why God commited “suicide”.

Some christians carry anger towards those that call themselves jews because they killed Jesus.

It might be difficult for some jews to accept Christ as the annointed of God as that would require that they acknowledge that their expectations, leaders and indoctrination killed Jesus, their prophecied messiah and the image, seed and will of God/humanity to the world. It would require them to rethink and reconsider the manner in which the annointed was to continue forever. It would eventually require them to expatriate and revolute (repent) from their rabbis interpretations and authority, whos doctrines and teachings are at the heart of the current (post 70 AD) understandings of judaism, and who consider and teach it the highest sin (anathma) to read the N.T. or consider Christ as Messiah.

Some jews further oppose Christ as Messish due to the common Christian teaching that Christ died to take on the punishment of our sins, saying that one man or person cannot rightfully take on the liability for another man’s sins.  This is partly accurate, but lacks understanding of the person, and reasons behind the statement. It lacks understanding that as prophecied and logically and reasonably deduced, God himself died [and needed to die] to take upon himself the penaties and enmities which the law and ‘death’ had effected., thereby cancelling the law, its chastisements, enmities and power.

The word sin primarily means “missing the mark.” The garden law of sin and death was instituted by God when mankind was in his infancy and ignorance [Acts 17:30] about God, himself and about life while in the culture and presence of an adversary. If God created mankind GOOD and in his image, and placed him in a garden of peace and rest, but with a potential to become ‘not good'” didn’t God himself bear part of the liability and responsibility for GOOD man’s ability & freedom to “miss the mark”, and also the effects of missing the mark? If the original ‘mark” was the instruction to not eat of the tree of Good/Evil and yet an outside influence of a liar was permitted, didn’t God himself bare part of the responsibility for that environment and thus also bare the responsibility to remedy the environment and create a new law and new environment?

And this is what is represented in the prophets and by Paul.

*[[Isa 53:5]] KJV* But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised [Gen 3:15] for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him [upon his shoulders]; and with his stripes we are healed. [healed from the enmity, fear and things induced from the ‘death’ of the garden law].

Mankinds foreknown and foreordained failure against the conditional law of peace and rest in the garden, and its judgements created fear, insecurity (death) and subsequent enmity:
between man and God,
between the man and woman;
between man and his inner man,
and between man and his fellow man.

Though the failure against the law was given a immediate future remedy, that also led to further enmity and jealousy unto SHEDDING OF BLOOD UPON THE EARTH as Cain in jealousy slew Abel after his (Abels) offering of faith and understanding in the future seed was favored over Cains offering and understanding of stressfull, toil, & labor from the fields as a ‘punishment’.

Christ/God himself, in partial responsibility, took upon himself the personal and later corporal effects and enmities of the garden law including those of post flood nimrodic, corporal ritualistic, enslaving religions culminating with and embodied in the mosaic covt..  Thus God/Christ atoned by his blood for the effects (the murder of Abel) that even the good, remedial promise (Gen 3:15) had caused up until the time of his incarnation; so that we might know the Good (grace, love & truth) and the evil ( law & fear) and choose the Good.

*[[Joh 1:29]] KJV* The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. by replacing the law of sin/death with the law of truth/life.

*[[Rev 13:8 ]]KJV* And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, [beast] whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

*[[Act 2:23]] KJV* Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

*[[Heb 2:14-15/KJV]]* v 14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; v 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Thus it was meet and neccessary (pleasing to God) for God himself to die a reciprocating death to atone for and bear the foreknown and foreordained enmities and effects which the law caused on the earth, and in the life, until the coming of the son of man [seed of Eve] to establish the new, everlasting, good laws of truth, logic and the love of God. Jesus/God cancelled and replaced the law of sin/death with the law of faith and life in himself, nailing the old law to his tree with Him.

*[[Act 17:30]] KJV* And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Thus Jesus/God was not killed by the jews, but responsibly permitted his atoning self orchestrated and purposed death foreplanned from the foundation of the world. 

*[[Joh 10:18/KJVLite]]* No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

*[[Joh 14:28-31/KJV]]* v 28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. v 29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe. v 30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh,and hath nothing in me. v 31 But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence.

*[[Act 2:23]] KJV* Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

*[[Rev 13:8/KJV]]* And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, (beast) whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

In his coming, he eradicated the stipulative garden law, replacing the enmity (death), fear and insecurity with unconditional love, peace, grace, and truth through faith. We should live in the freedoms (and constraints) of the teachings, example and truths of the new Adam and his love.

*[[Rev 20:14/KJV]]* And death (enmity, hate, striving) and hell (conditional, fear inspired authoritative religions) were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death (spiritual, soul and mind enmity of the inner man)

For those jews who might find it difficult to accept that Jesus was Messiah due to the fact that it would require that they acknowledge that they had killed the(ir) messiah, understanding how & why his being killed was required to be the atonement and light for all men may help them recieve Jesus as the creators loving, good incarnation. He (and the seed promised through Eve) was/is the symbolic intent of Abel’s experience, of Lamechs proclamation, of Noahs experience; of the characteristics of the seed being passed through Abraham/Sara’s experience[and the confirming physical lineage] in Gen 12, 15 & 17.

*[[Isa 53:5-12/KJV]]* v 5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised [Gen 3:15] for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. v 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. v 7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. v 8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. v 9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. v 10p Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. v 11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities. v 12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Thus, how did Jesus’ soul make an offering for sin; become an intercessor for the transgressors. How did his dying, bear our iniquities?
By changing and cancelling the law of enmity, and taking on its punishment, the accuser of the bretheren is cast out while God and his beloved humanity continue and are changed. Rom 8:28

The strength of ‘sin'” is the law and where there is no law, there is no sin or transgression. He called the law of sin/death bad, and established the law of faith (John 6:28,29 Rom 3:27-31) as GOOD, life and righteousness.

*[[Rom 4:15]] KJV* Because the law worketh wrath: [enmity] for where no law is, there is no transgression.

*[[1Co 15:55-56/KJV]]* v 55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? v 56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

To just say that “Jesus died for ‘my’ sin” can imply an intended continuation of both his dying, of law, and thus of “my sin.” It is weak and incomplete compared to understanding that the authority of missing the mark (sin) was the conditional law of death which induced enmity and fear. God/Jesus didn’t just ‘die for my “sin” ‘ but atoned for and rightfully accepted the enmity which his law had temporarily effected; killing that law, its accuser and”death” while replacing it with laws of goodness, truth, grace and Life, through faith. The law of life, love and truth displaced and superceded the law of death.

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Key verses historically misunderstood which, when corrected, support preterism .

1.  The words “times and seasons”.
In Acts 1 and 1 Thess 5 “times and seasons” is a phrase referring to the feasts and festivals comemmorating events of the 40 year time, from leaving egypt to crossing Jordan, to establish the temporary, anti-thetical nation of the mosaic covt. 

[Acts 1:7;] And he said unto them, It is not for you to know [experience] the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.
*[1Th 5:1]* But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

In lev 23 & numbers 28 & 29, the people are instructed that these feast and festival commemorations are to be observed in their times and seasons. 

*[[Lev 23:4]] KJV* These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.

*[[Num 28:2]] KJV* Command the children of Israel, and say unto them, My offering, and my bread for my sacrifices made by fire, for a sweet savour unto me, shall ye observe to offer unto me in their due season.
Numbers 29:39 These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts,

Using these words in Acts 1 and 1 Thess 5:1, Jesus, (Acts 1) and the apostle (1 Thess 5:1) were affirming that the topics being discussed would occur during the next 40 yrs, fulfilling and replacing the mosaic covt feasts and festivals, (times and seasons) confirming and establishing the new, good nation of the new, everlasting covt.

That the “new” nation is to have ordinances contrary or antithetical to that of the mosaic covt is evident in Jer 31:32-33, Ez 20;25ff & Is 65:1,2. below. That the GOOD new covt peoples of God/Jesus indwelling is to be thought of as a nation with ordinances, statutes, principles, laws of truth, etc. is found in the verses of Isaiah followiing these.

*[[Jer 31:32-33/KJV]]* Not according to the covenant (mostly,the book of duet as declared in deut 5:1-3) that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: %v 33% But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my (new) law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

*[[Eze 20:25]] KJV* Wherefore I gave them also statutes that were not good, and judgments whereby they should not live;

*[[Isa 65:1-2/KJV]]* v 1. I am sought of them that asked not for me; I am found of them that sought me not: I said, Behold me, behold me, unto a nation that was not called by my name. v 2. I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people, which walketh in a way that was not good, after their own thoughts;

For they had not had the new law and circumcised heart through the Good, loving, atoning trancendance and incarnation of the creator yet. They were still seeking release from and were thus under felt condemnation of the garden law.

*[[Deu 5:23-29/KJV]]* v 23 And it came to pass, when ye heard the voice out of the midst of the darkness, (for the mountain did burn with fire,) that ye came near unto me, even all the heads of your tribes, and your elders; v 24 And ye said, Behold, the LORD our God hath shewed us his glory and his greatness, and we have heard his voice out of the midst of the fire: we have seen this day that God doth talk with man, and he liveth. v 25 Now therefore why should we die? for this great fire will consume us: if we hear the voice of the LORD our God any more, then we shall die. v 26. For who is there of all flesh, that hath heard the voice of the living God speaking out of the midst of the fire, as we have, and lived? v 27 Go thou near, and hear all that the LORD our God shall say: and speak thou unto us all that the LORD our God shall speak unto thee; and we will hear it, and do it. v 28 And the LORD heard the voice of your words, when ye spake unto me; and the LORD said unto me, I have heard the voice of the words of this people, which they have spoken unto thee: they have well said all that they have spoken. v 29 O that there were such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children for ever!

These are some verses which speak of the new indwelling kingdom of God through Jesus as a nation.

*[[Isa 26:2/KJV]]* Open ye the gates, that the righteous nation which keepeth the truth may enter in.
*[[Isa 26:15/KJV]]* Thou hast increased the nation, O LORD, thou hast increased the nation: thou art glorified: thou hadst removed it far unto all the ends of the earth.
*[[Isa 51:4/KJV]]* Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, (Jon 6:28,29; Rom 3:31; Matt 16:18-21; 1 John 3:21-23) and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people.
*[[Isa 55:5/KJV]]* Behold, thou shalt call a nation that thou knowest not, and nations that knew not thee shall run unto thee because of the LORD thy God, and for the Holy One of Israel; for he hath glorified thee.
*[[Isa 60:22/KJV]]* A little one shall become a thousand, and a small one a strong nation: I the LORD will hasten it in his time.
*[[Isa 66:8/KJVLite]]* Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.

In Acts 1, the Angel states that the apostles would not know (this is a greek word that can mean “EXPERIENCE”) these times and seasons.  They WOULD all experience the new covt feast of Pentacost together when the spirit descended like fire and they recieved the ability of tongues.. All but John suffered martydom prior to 70 AD. It had been suggested in John 21:18-23 that John would live through the persecutions and martydoms, which would take the lives of Peter and the others, and WOULD experience (know) the times and seasons of at least the next 40 years.

[Acts 1:7;] And he said unto them, It is not for you to know [experience] the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

*[[Joh 21:18-23/KJV]]* v 18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not. v 19. This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me. v 20. Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? v 21. Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? v 22. Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. v 23. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

In 1 Thess 5:1,4;  Paul tells his first century readers that they were not in the dark concerning the times and seasons that the day would overtake them surprisingly.

*[[1Th 5:1]] KJV* But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
*[[1Th 5:4]] KJV* But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.  *[[1Th 5:5]] KJV* Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

See also

(Matt 24:36 & Mark 13:32) with zech 14:6-9.
 The words are; “OF”   that day, no man knoweth……. Jesus was not saying that no one would know the day (date) nor hour, but was saying that no man, nor angel, nor the son had seen or understood the culture and spiritual environment of the day of the  new heavens and earth of the full, complete effectually establishing of the new covt.

Tbe preposition “OF” declares added description about the event (day) that he’s been talking about, not a statement about the date.  I believe that Jesus is bringing zech 14:6-8 into the olivet discourses narrative about 70 AD.

*[[Mat 24:36]] KJV* But OF that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

*[[Zec 14:6-9/KJV]]* v 6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark: v 7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light. %v 8% And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be. v 9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

3.  2 Peter 3;  
2 Peter 1:16-21 defines that 2 Peter 3 is referring to the destruction of the mosaic covt  by fire, not the physical earth.

*[[2Pe 1:18-19/KJV]]* v 18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. v 19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts.

Vs 19 mentions a prophecy of the voice being heard from heaven.  This is a referral to deut 18:15-19 which prophecied the removal of the disbelieving part of the people at the time of the coming of the new prophet.

*[[Deu 18:15-19/KJV]]* v 15 The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken; v 16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not. v 17 And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. v 18. I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. v 19. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

Peter is saying that he heard the voice from heaven at the transfiguration which was first heard at his baptism, thus fulfilling the prophecy. Peter had made mention of the prophecy of the ascociated judgement coming to the disbelieving of Judea in Acts 3:22-24.

2 Peter 3 is a continuation of the explanation of the then soon coming judgement upon judea using propetic language such as Deut 32:22 as a source text for 2 Peter 3:10,12.

*[[Deu 32:22]] KJV* For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

*[[2Pe 3:10]] KJV* But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

*[[2Pe 3:12]] KJV* Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

See also

4. The subject matter of Rev 15:3 demands that the theme and scope of the letter of Revelation applied to 1 century 66-70 AD judea. 

*[[Rev 15:3]] KJV* And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints. 

The song of moses is deut 32 which prophecied the events of the end of the mosaic covt nation at the time of the establishing the new covt nation.

5.  Hebrews 9:28, 10:37 & 12:26,27.

Heb 9:28 is associated with Is 66:5 and refers to a first century prrservation and deliverance.

*[[Heb 9:28]] KJV* So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

*[[Isa 66:5]] KJV* Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name’s sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed.

Heb 10:37 refers to Titus and the Romans as one who was to soon come.  It is a referral to dan 9:26.  Due to the prophecy in Deut 32:42, we can assurredly say that Jesus’ method of rendering vengeance on his enemies and protection to his sons & daughters of peace was through Titus and the other leaders of Rome.

*[[Heb 10:37]] KJV* For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.

*[[Dan 9:26]] KJV* And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

*[[Deu 32:42]] KJV* I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; and that with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.

[nkjv reads; from (or through) the long-haired heads of the enemy]

Hebrews 12:26 & 27;
As confirmed from the previous context, the removal of things that are made and the shaking of the heavens and earth refers to the articles and foundations of mosaic covt temple worship as the things made with hands that were to be removed.

*[[Heb 12:26-27/KJV]]* v 26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven. v 27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

In the previous context (and from the context of Haggai’s prophecy) the “things that are made” were discussed as articles of the (2nd) mosaic covt (Solomonic) temple rituals.

*[[Heb 9:2]] KJV* For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which is called the sanctuary.

*[[Heb 9:11/KJVLite]]* But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;

*[[Heb 9:24/KJVLite]]* For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:

6.John 14:3

*[[Joh 14:3]] KJV* And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

It’s often ascerted that this is a prooving text for the return of Jesus and sometimes of the rapture of the church.

But in this conversation of chs 14-17, Jesus was referring to his leaving by his death and his return to them after his resurrection and having recieved the kingdom from the father. (Dan 7:13,14) This was fulfilled in John 20:19-23.

Jesus had said that he would prepare a place; and return to them that where he is they would be also.   In the teachings of chs 14-17 Jesus is bringing the father & spirit of Himself (now approved and judicially given a kingdom and govt for/of humanity) to dwell in them on the earth, not the other way around. Heaven and the white throne judgement of Dan 7 comes to dwell on earth in the truths about life, its Divine origins and its Goodness as admisistered and delivered by the word (expression) of God.

7. Matt 5:17-19
*[[Mat 5:17-19/KJV]]* %v 17% Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. %v 18% For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. %v 19% Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Many people interpret this section to mean that the law or at least the ten commandments are to remain in effect until the passing of the phydical heavens and earth. They would thus also allow or even promote a God ordained continuation of a national mosaic covt Israel, though perhaps seperate from the ‘church. The article linked here below explains and discusses Matt 5.


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Christian-Preterist songs in mainstream Music

This is a collection of songs which I’ve come to understand in a preterist or christian context and expression. Some of them (space cowboy, won’t get fooled again) express more preterist thoughts and theology than others, and several of the songs can have several meanings and interpretations. This allowance for multiple interpretations is sometimes termed artistic anonominity. Thus an artist themself might not specify the intent and meaning of the song. But several are so overtly preterist and positively evangelical that its difficult to deny the meaning and intent.

Steve Miller Band

I want to make the world turn around.

Wintertime. (A contrasting positive theme of the summertime’ prophecy in the olivet discourse; but the dispensational/futurist wind blows so ch(urch)ill

The Window. (Gather your [fig] leaves together: gather your shame, insecurity and fear together)
Living in the U.S.A.( new way, new set of [jesus] words)
Space Cowboy.
Jet Airliner; fly like an eagle; (like a cross, let my spirit carry me)
Jungle Love. Commemorates the flood making the earth better (Gen 5:29) and the time if his meeting in the island of the mosaic covt nation. Lately they lived in a jungle of religious legalism whi h was also washed away.

Cry, Cry, Cry. (Blues for a beautiful world)
Babys house.
Behind blue eyes.
Wide River. (EZ 47)
Your Saving Grace. (Goodness of Heaven)
Rock Love

The Who;
Who are you
Real Good looking Boy (associated with Rom 7).
Baba O’reilley.
Eminence Front. dressed to kill like lamech killed the negativity and ‘curse’ of his environment invoked by the effective “young man” (serpent) in Gen 4.
Won’t get fooled again. (A song commemorating the new covenant and the apostolic leaving of judea in 66-70 AD.)
Love, Reign over me.

Don Mclean;
American Pie. (The ‘day the music died’ could be the rise of the dispensational, & zionist theology, and false “gospel”.  His ‘widowed bride’ are widowed in the sense that, according to their understanding, Jesus’ gospel was rejected and the kingdom postponed and is “dead’ with him until his alledged return. 

Five for fighting;
100 years. One tree of life in the meadow in the video.

Jesus Jones;
Right here, right now.

Christina Perri;
1000 years.

The Doors;
Love me two times.

Rare Earth;
Woodstock; back to the garden.

For Pete’s sake.

Tazmin Archer
Sleeping Satellite.



The Zombies
Holy Moses

Into the light

Juke Box Hero (One guitar- Zech 14:9)

Feeling Good, as sung by Carly Rose Sonenclaire.

Modern @2015 song performed by several.
“Clap your hands if you believe that happiness is the truth” (John 1:17)

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Did Isaiah 7:8 prophecy Antichrist, Gog, (Simon Bar Kochbah) and 132-135 AD?

As some of you know, I believe  that the milleniums (its plural of 1000 yrs) of Rev 20 were the 4 measurements of 1000 prophecied in Ez 47. I believe they all culminated in @ 70 AD or 30-70 AD. (See the post titled “The plurality of 1000 years”)

The Gog/Magog war was to come a short season (Rev 20:3) after the millenium(s). But we aren’t told what a ‘short season’ is/was. Some preterist connect the event to occurrances in 70AD or, as I once had, of Masada in 73 AD. But the characters, and imagery of the description of Ez 38/39 didn’t fit with 70 or 73 AD, even if individual believers were to be considered unwalled villages as the ‘camp of the saints’ of Rev 20:9.

I had already believed that since Ezekiel chs. 34, 36 & 37 had references to the new covt of eternal life in Christ (David; Ez 37:24,25) that “my people Israel” in 37:23,27; & 38:14,17 was referring to the disciples and followers of Christ as king (Ez 37:22).

Further hints were;
a. that it would come AFTER the scattered of Israel were brought back from the sword. (Ez 38:8) The sword, in the time context of the new covt, is a reference to such first century prophecies as Deut 32:42; Is. 65:12, 66:16 and thus 70 AD.
b. Gog would be turned back from looting and plundering “my people Israel” while they were living in unwalled villages. c. It would be after the land had been cleared from ‘wild beasts’ (referring either to actual animal or to how the goals of unprincipled men can be likened to devouring wild beasts.)

Thus, realizing that the time of the sword in Ez 38:8 was a reference to 70 AD, I began looking for an event a short season’ (Rev 20:3) beyond 70AD which involved a regathering of peoples (Ez 38:8). I had already been considering the Bar kochbah revolt as the “double honour” of Is 61:7 and elsewhere.

I had contemplated to myself that if I could find some way to verify a 65 yr time period prophecied from 70 AD to135 AD that it would help confirm a growing hypothesis that the battle of Gog/magog referred to the Bar Kochbah revolt in 132-135 AD. I scoured my memory for references to 65 yrs and came up empty. 40 Yr and 70 yr periods were frequent but I knew of no mention of a 65 year timeframe.

Around Christmas of 2013, I was reading over the Immanuel prophecy of Is 9 and the context of ch 7-9 to see the perspective of weather the Govt (Constitution) of God for humanity rested upon his (Immanuels) shoulders or if (as we’ve often been taught) the govt of man was oppressing Immanuel. I found that the former is represented by the prophecy and fulfilled by Christs teachings, laws of spiritual truths and religious freedoms.

But in reading this section I was quickened by the mention of 65 yrs from the time of the prophecy to the time of the end of Damascus in Isaiah 7:8.

I dismissed it as coincidence at first and put it aside for several days and then read more in context. I came to believe that this section is a prophecy about the Gog//magog conflict. Some brief research into the events and charcters involved in this conflict using Wikipedia, Jewish, Christian and secular sources further supported the hypothesis.

point 1:
A prophecy in Isaiah 10:14-19 and ch.14 about the Assyrian conquest has similar language found in deut 32:27 of what was prophecied about Romes conquest of Judea in 70 A.D, namely that they would say that their Gods had prevailed and were superior to Israels God.

2. The Assyrian captivity/conquest of Israel was, like the Babylonian captivity/conquest of Judah, a foreshadow of a roman invasion. I believe the Babylonian conquest of Judah (and the Medes subsequent conquest of Babylon Is 13) foretyped the Roman invasion of Judea in 66-70 Ad. The Assyrian conquest of the northern kingdom and then the fall of the Assyrian empire foretyped 132-135 AD. After 70AD, jewish national sympathizers and intermarried descendants of the dispersed northern tribes (previously considered gentile or samaratain and ‘not the people of God” by judah) would be brought back into the land from dispersion along with some of the believers. (see Isaiah 66:18-21).

3. That name (maher-shalal-hash-baz) means loot and plunder, the same to some extent, of what is prophecied in Ez 38:10-14

4. The phrase “My people Israel” after the establishment of the new principles and laws of the new covt by Christ refers to those justified in their humanity through faith in Christ (the Good God) of which jacob/Israel was a foretype. We note a contrasting differentiation between the phrases “my people Israel” and “thy people” as in Dan 9:24 the latter of which refers to people of mosaic national Israel while the former to people of faith in the new Covenant words and entity of Jesus, as the seed promised to humanity through Eve.

Thus Gog is the prince of the people who was coming to loot & plunder the christian or the humanitarian/divine way of life, peace, freedom & Good truth. This activity could just as, or more likely refer to Bar kochbah and the san hedrain as much as Hadrian and the romans. The idea of “loot and plunder” could have several meanings and means including looting through subjugation and taxation or through robbing and oppressing of truths. Jesus may have even contrasted himself against Gog (Maher shalal hash baz) in John 10:10 & 5:43. Thus Bar Kokhba would have attempted to “steal”” the truth, power, freedom and love of God through Jesus as the true messiah by claiming messiahship for himself.

From what I’ve gleaned in my readings Bar kochbah and the san hedrain renewed persecution, harrassment, oppression and even killing of the Christ believers. When the jews under the San hedrain announce Bar Kokhba as ” MESSIAH” and formed plans for military occupation, defiance, autonomy and revolt, the believers (Nazarenes, Ebonites, Essenes, etc.) seperated from the common re-inhabitation and again (as in 70 AD) left the land.

5. In Is 9:9,10, it says that they would say in their pride, the bricks have fallen, but we will rebuild with hewn stone. This is exactly the mentality of the sanhedrain after 70 AD where a carefull analysis was made as to why the revolt of 70 AD had failed. An opinion and belief emerged that it was due to two brothers appealing to a roman official (General Pompey) to solve a dispute between them over a jewish political office. It was NOT determined that it was because the new prophet had come and the new covt established. (See Eli Ravage; Commissary to the Gentiles) To this day, parts of the judicial system maintain a perspective that an appeal to the court is an admission and subjection to their jurisdiction rather that to common law jurisdiction and common sense or divine law and divine sense. I believe this may be a continued fruit of that faulty evaluation of why the revolt of 70 AD failed.

6. Though the immediate subject in question in Is 7-10 is the Assyrians, Israel, Ephraim, Samaria & Damascus of Isaiahs time era; the scope of the prophecy includes reference to a time period future to Isaiah & Ahaz by the inclusion of the Immanuel prophecy. Thus, as babylon refers to jerusalem and Judah of 70 AD, Damascus, Assyria, etc coorelates to Jerusalem and Israel etc of 132-135 AD. Some were taken as preists and Kings (some came to believe) from that group also as prophecied in Is 66:21.

7. For the 3rd time, if not more Jerusalem of a mosaic covt principled ideology was destroyed on the 9 th of Av.

8 IF, I say If, Cush, Tubal etc is meant to refer to the northern tribes repopulation of Judea and the Sanhedrain attempt and side of the revolt , then Bar Kochbah would be accurately represented as Gog; claimed prince of the reinhabitation. This could also be part of the implications of Johns saying in 1 John 2:18 that “You have heard” that the antichrist is coming. Ez 38:17

Not only did John mean that any spirit or teaching that denies that Jesus had come and comes continuously indwelling generations of those who believe on and recieve him and his words as truth; (i.e. Eat Him from john 6:32-63) and that many false prophets were already making claims of themselves; he also seems to allow a hearing or opinion that a coming of a singular anti-christ (Gog) was being discussed among them. Ez 38:17

Cush, Tubal, the land of Magog, etc. was, from some research I did, a reference to coastal areas of the seas where people dispersed to and settled after the flood, especially that of the east/northeast of the mediterreanean sea (magog).

9. In Is 8:8 Maher-shalal-hash-baz is mockingly called “O Immanuel” and in Ezek 39:1 the same mocking attitude of the greatness of “O Gog” is depicted. So logically Maher shalal hash baz and Gog could be the same individual and be a false proclaimant of being Immanuel and “Messiah”. And in fact the title of “Messiah” was given to Simon bar kochbah by the San hedrain. He was also alledged to be the scepter and star arising out of Jacob of Balaams prophecy of Numbers 24:17.

There is no reference to ‘anti-christ’ in Dan 9 since the covt confirmed (established) for one week is the everlasting covt of Deut 30:6,11-14. It is established in living history by “Messiah” teachings & freeing love & truths and the indwelling & authority of those truths in his disciples from 27-33 AD and beyond. The everlasting covt prophecied in deut 30:6 & 11-14 was to come after the captivity in babylon and after calling to mind the curse of the law of moses as stated in Deut 30:1-5. Daniel, in his prayer in Dan 9, confessed the babylonian captivity as the curse of the law and reminded God of the prophecied everlasting covt of mercy. The angel brings Daniel news of a 483 yr time period interjected between vs 5 & 6 of Dan 9; between the return from captivity and the delivering of the new covt. (See the post titled “20 questions….

Messiah (Christ) and Immanuel are both names of the same person, thus Maher shalal hash baz (anti-Immanuel) was rightly referred to as ‘anti-christ’ in 1 John 2:18. Ez 38:17 indicates that the people of this time (post 70 AD) were to wonder who was the one mentioned by the prophets to Israel. Since I don’t believe “anti-christ” is mentioned or referred to in Dan 9 the primary, if not only place that I know of where a antithesis of Immanuel/Messiah is prophecied is Isaiah 8:1,3,8.

10. This would also satisfy the prophecy of the double honor (Is 61:7 and others) and test and reward (Is 66:22) the second generation with keeping the constitution of Peace and love for all humanity (non religious, non-racial faith in the visitation and authority of the life-maker).

To clarify the foretype; Just as Medes conquest of Babylon (Isaiah 13) was a foretype of the romans conquest/invasion of Judea (called babylon after the new covt of Christ) in 70 AD; so also the fall of the Assyrian empire (another babylon) along with Samaria, Ephraim, (tribes of Israel) was a foretype of a second conquest of a reestablishment attempt of Israel/Jerusalem in 132-135 after Immanuel and the Good way of life and peace is established.

The conquest and judgement in favor of the followers, freed and lovers of Christ is again accomplished through Rome but there is a reciprocal retribution against Rome (also Assyrian/babylonian/pagan in nature) since they lost similar numbers in the 132/135 conflict.

As was prophecied in Ez 38:21; every mans sword was against his brother.

Seldom if ever is an event covered by a single prophecy. Passages that I believe referred to the bar kochbah revolt in 132-135 or to the time between 70 Ad & 135 are as follows.

Parts of Isaiah 7, 8, 9 & all of chapter 10;
The “Assyrian” of ch 10 and Micah 5 is Gog.
Isaiah 11:11-16
(Possibly Is 40:2)
Is 61:7
Is 66:18-21
(Possibly Jer 17:18 with context)
Ezek 38 & 39
Micah 5; the Assyrian
Zech 9:12
Zech 14:8-24
The little scroll of Rev 10:7-11 and thus the message of the 7th angel and 7 thunders when time (waiting for prophecy) should be no more or as John put it in 1 John 2:18, the last hour.
Rev 18:6
Rev 20:3
(Possibly others)
John 5:43
John 10:10
Eph 2:2,3
John 12:31
John 14:30
John 16:11

I along with other prrterist believe that the rev was written before and primarily applied to 66-70 AD. Rev 10:11 prophecied that John was to prophecy again. I believe that Johns epistles were written after 70 AD and that the ‘last hour’ (1 John 2:18) was thus referring to the time of the little scroll. and the little season of Rev 20:3. Thus the mention that they had heard that ‘anti-christ’ was coming in 1 john 2:18 would have been a reference to Gog, Maher-shalal-hash-baz (or anti-Immanuel”) of Is 8:1,3,8, who turned out to be Simon Bar Kochbah.

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